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Today's Nuze

"When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it."

Frederic Bastiat

SOME RANDOM THOUGHTS ON OBAMA'S HEALTH SPEECH

By
Neal Boortz
@ September 10, 2009 9:09 AM
Permalink | Comments (109) | TrackBacks (0)

Unfortunately the story today will be the classless rudeness of S.C. Republican Joe Wilson rather than the gaping logic holes in Obama's speech. Usually that type of boorish behavior is reserved for liberals when a conservative is speaking on a college campus.

Who will be the first to call Joe Wilson a racist?

Wilson can't claim a momentary and uncontrollable lapse of judgment. He walked in there with a sign that said "no bull."

Of course illegal aliens won't be covered. That would be because by the time this plan is put into effect they won't be "illegal" any more. They will have been legitimized by a Democrat party seeking more core voters.

And then there's this ... if illegal aliens aren't going to be covered, then why does he include the 10 to 12 million uninsured illegal aliens in the number of the uninsured when he's promoting ObamaCare?

One more thing ... Wilson's outburst would have been par for the course in the British Parliament. Ever listen to those characters when the Prime Minister is speaking?

Reports are that Chris Matthews was hospitalized last night with uncontrollable thrills running up and down his leg.

Obama says that monopolies can stifle competition. He's right. So where were his suggestions as to how to increase competition among private insurance companies? Obama's solution to health insurance monopolies? Give government the monopoly. A monopoly with guns. How nice.

Obama talks about right wing scare tactics used to fight his health care plan. Then he says that without his plan more people ... thousands more ... will die. So just who is using the scare tactics?

Obama wants to save money? How about curtailing whatever government program it is that buys electric scooters for lardasses. Do you know that taxpayers spend billions of dollars a year on this?

I only counted three "tax the rich" moments in the speech last night. Did I miss any?

Obama managed to get in a few slams against the evil "profit motive." In Obama's world anyone seeking to make a profit from their efforts is to be scorned. The desire to make a profit is always suspect.

Still pushing the "public option" - really a government option. Why so essential? This is the poison dart aimed at private insurers. This is the clear path to single payer. Obama knows it. Democrats know it. And they know that most of the great unwashed don't' know it.

No taxpayer money for the government option? Does he really expect us to buy that dog squeeze? As soon as the government health insurance option runs into trouble there will be "emergency" bailout bills presented in congress -- because to do otherwise would be to jeopardize the health care of millions of Americans, and we just can't do that, can we?

Obama says that no one would be "required" to chose the government option. Wiggle room: The law won't require you to join, but when your private insurance company is run out of business by the government plan you won't really have another choice.

Obama kept talking about competition. Fine. Then let health insurance companies sell their products across state lines. Also ... get rid of the asinine mandates. Why should you be forced to buy insurance that covers you for hair transplants in Connecticut? Why should some who doesn't drink have to buy insurance that covers alcohol rehab? Ditto for drug rehab.



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What others are saying

  • Wilson's outbreak
    An honest emotion. Goof for him! He apologized, approriately. Now it is over!
  • Joe Wilson
    Congrats to Joe Wilson! I agree with Kenny Boy's comment about Joe Wilson's manhood. It's time the rest of the Republicans grew a spinal cord.
  • Joe Wilson's outburst..
    Hoorah- finally a republican with a set of gonads. Maybe we can farm him out for a reasonable fee & in return get some future republicans with intestinal fortitude..
  • please?
    we are in the MTV generation but still supposed to go by the "show class rule" Neal u are smarter. got 2 get the word out !!
  • Non-profit motive has been tried
    President Obama wants to create a company whose purpose is to pay for health care. That company should be insulated from any profit motive - e.g. be not for profit, perhaps even charitable.

    Hmm... starting in the 1930's legislation was enacted in most states creating non-profit charitable organizations that became known as Blue Cross and Blue Shield Plans.

    If the President's idea for removing the profit motive is so good, why doesn't President Obama point to those Blue Plans that still are non-profit charities and say this is what we want more of in the US?

    Could it be the President is not really interested in eliminating the profit motive to create competition, as much as he is interested in getting government into health insurance?

    Or could it be because almost all the Blue Plans that still are non-profit, charitable organizations have a dominant market share in the states in which they do business, which means that removing the profit motive has nothing to do with creating competition? Which of course brings us back to the first question, which is could it be the President really just wants government in health care?
  • Obama Health Nut
    Obama has not had a clue about anything since BEFORE he took office. The only thing he has accomplished is running Microsoft to Canada and pissing off 75% of America. Mission accomplished....Oh, and I will let the 15-20% REAL unemployment rate slide since Bush started this mess. Both are idiots and we are left yet again looking for real leadership...change my ass.
  • Joe Wilson
    I was very disappointed last night when Joe Wilson confronted Obama about his lie. His fellow Republicans should have given his a standing ovation. The gutless wonders just sat there. (Not the time or place)The time to confront a lie is when it's made. And stop calling it health care reform. The Republicans have health care reform, Obama has socialize madicine. Nothing less. We're free falling into Marxism and the spineless Repubicans are just sitting and being polite. START FIGHTING.
  • Wilson's sign
    It did not say "no bull". It said "What Bill".... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUC2rGj2VqE 2:35 or so.
  • YOU LIE OBAMA
    Dear libtards, your corrupt pres. was embarrased in front of the entire world, and nothing will EVER change that! YOU LIE!!!!!!HA HA HA
  • T-Shirt
    So that's how you think they're limiting the supply! haha, yeah lets just lower all the standards/requirements to becoming a doctor. That makes perfect sense then we'll have plenty of doctors, sure they may be to stupid to do their job but don't worry about that it's just another detail to "iron out"!

    The fact of the matter is that it's a highly skilled job that the majority of people simply can't do.
  • Wilson's comment
    Obama is always lying or distorting the truth. It is about time someone challenged him on it. The democrats were much ruder to Bush. As a matter of fact all presidents were given respect until Bush.
  • Inappropriate comment by Wilson, but...
    'Wilson can't claim a momentary and uncontrollable lapse of judgment. He walked in there with a sign that said "no bull."'

    Yes. Wilson's comment was inappropriate.

    But I don't really know if carrying a "no bull" sign necessarily means that his comment was not spontaneous.

    He knows that such outbursts are inappropriate in the US Congress, but fine for the British House of Commons.

    And he apologized.

    I'll give him a pass here.
  • Who would Jesus screw for a profit?
    I demand and I dare any Senator or Congressmen who votes against health care reform to give up the taxpayer supported insurance they have that we pay for, if its not good enough for us its bad for them. Give up your heath insurance congressmen; it’s a government run plan. Tax dollars pay for it. That’s our money taken by force to cover you. If you don’t think its good enough for you, then drop it and go out in the market place and find and pay for your own out of your salary. But if you keep it, then offer it as a choice option for the rest of us.
  • pictures and video
    Were there pictures and video of millions of people dying on America's streets because of a lack of health care? Or some scarcity of it?

    I didn't think so

    Yeah. Big crisis.
  • i didn't say that i disliked capitalism
    can you get that through your thick heads? i asked you about chinese capitalists because you said capitalism is freedom. its not.

    Oh, and you suck at arguing your point.
  • Wilson's Comment
    Congress booed Bush during joint session, Obama called Clinton "a bold faced liar"....and Wilson pointed out the fact that Obama was lying...don't see anything wrong with it...somebody needed to do it....
  • t-shirt doctor
    T-shirt said:

    "i said health care capitalism."

    From your post titled: "health insurance companies" dtd: "By tshirt-doctor.com @ 09/10/09 10:03:06 AM"

    Explain where you used the term "health care capitalism" in an argument with me? Appears you have been kissing Obama's cheeks for so long that the whole world looks like the wrong end of a burro to you. Are Obama's ears long and fluffy too? Please feel free to express your inner liberal feelings.
  • Doc
    t-shirt doctor
    Define the term "Chinese Capitalist"

    Thus far, you have made no argument here. So, define the term. You have Google, Yahoo, and internet at your fingertips. Find an Article in the Wall Street Journal, Forbes, etc., where the term is used. And have the guts to state your position. Explain what system you would find equitable, innovative, and ethical.
    By Off the reservation

    He would probably go for The Federalist Papers.

    Doc's ok most times, he's just very very anti-corporation of any variety. It's actually amazing we manage to be friends!

    But your stories of the reservation are amazing, I've seen some of that recently on a news show. Incredible how government has screwed that up and we want them to run our health care. Question, are ya'll able to go off reservation for health care? If you do, is it all out of your own pocket?

    Behave Doc!!!
  • By Off the reservation
    http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/09/american_socialism_chinese_cap.html

    http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0110-42.htm
  • Oh well, I tried
    Doc,

    I asked you to define an alternative to the profit motive that would be more just and moral, but you merely continued to say what you did not like about the capitalist system.

    I made a point to illustrate the fallacy of an altruist, price-controlled system, which you somehow tried to turn into an indictment of my values.

    I said that capitalism is freedom, and its absence requires a surrender of freedom, and you tried to turn this into a discussion about China.

    In summary, I tried to have a constructive conversation and genuinely tried to understand the basis of your position... and you dodged, changed the subject, and tried to throw it back at me.

    You have nothing to offer but emotional outbursts. You lack the moral clarity or high ground to judge others. You cannot back up your assertions with substance. When cornered, you resort to misdirection, putting words in peoples' mouths, and name-calling. All you are managing to do, with each post, is validate your opponents.

    Oh, and you suck at arguing your point.
  • t-shirt doctor
    Define the term "Chinese Capitalist"

    Thus far, you have made no argument here. So, define the term. You have Google, Yahoo, and internet at your fingertips. Find an Article in the Wall Street Journal, Forbes, etc., where the term is used. And have the guts to state your position. Explain what system you would find equitable, innovative, and ethical.
  • Wow this story is spreading
    http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/53814
  • Rullivan
    oh yes they are http://bradhicks.livejournal.com/432458.html
  • Off the reservation
    i said health care capitalism. please read what i said you dumba$$. you liberal skunk!
  • Weew
    so you saying the chinese capitalist are just a free as you.

    al-righty then!
  • Actually, this would NOT be par for the course in the UK
    In the UK parliament you are NOT ALLOWED to accuse another politician of lying within the House of Commons or the House of Lords. It's unparliamentary language and can get you cautioned and expelled by the speaker from that session if you're a repeat offender. You can accuse another politician of lying outside Parliament of course, and you can accuse them indirectly. E.g 'The right honorable member has misrepresented the facts of the case...' but to call someone a liar directly is a no-no. It's a loose rule with lots of ways to get around it. There's never any ambiguity if one side thinks the other is being untruthful they will make it known, but the rules about parliamentary language at least allow the debate to retain a measure of civility and sense.

    From wiki article on unparliamentary languge:

    In House of Commons of the United Kingdom, the following words have been deemed unparliamentary over time: blackguard, coward, git, guttersnipe, hooligan, ignoramus, liar, rat, swine, stoolpigeon, and traitor.[6] Apparently, the word shit is not unparliamentary language when used as a noun to refer to faeces[7] Furthermore, 'sod', 'slimy', 'wart', accusations of 'crooked deals' or insinuation of the use of banned substances by a member are also considered unparliamentary language (all attributable to Dennis Skinner).
  • Off the reservation
    you still didn't answer the question

    you words are just an idiot blathering away.
  • Use the word 'july' in a sentence.
    Obama said Illegals will not be allowed in this healthcare system.

    "July, july julyer!"

    He's my newest hero!
  • Weew
    First, we seize the land from whoever owns it....

    that's your idea not mine. you can't imagine how it would peacefully done. that says a lot about you.
  • T-Shirt -- weew
    tshirt-doctor said:

    "Capitalism IS freedom. you sure about that? what about those red chinese capitalists? they got their millions and billions the old capitalist ways."

    Very good. Very liberal. When you are fighting a hopeless battle change the terms and start a new fight.

    Your original posting decried private insurance and capitalism. So, stay on task. What has socialism done for you? What about socialism has made your life so enjoyable? Why must poor liberal socialists like you go after people who are successful, hard working, and charitable? Why does it make you so mad to see a successful person? You can be successful, too. There is nothing stopping you other than your own ignorance, apathy, and liberal perspective. Please, allow me to kick you in your fourth point of contact. Please, allow me to show you how to be successful. Let me show you how to take an idea and make it work. It does no good to come whining like a liberal about how nothing works for you. The only opportunity you missed was to get your sorry butt out of bed.
  • Oh, and one last thing, doc
    You never answered my original question: What alternative to the profit motive woud you consider to be moral and just?
  • @Gavin
    "If Nancy Pelosi should resign her position as Speaker because she dared to say the CAI misled her, what should Joe Wilson do for calling the President of the United States of America a liar?"

    Neither one should do anything because of what they said. Freedom of speech and all that.

    However, I do think Nancy should resign on the grounds that she is a brain-dead hypocrite.....and that she is lying through her teeth. But then again, that describes pretty much all liberals.
  • t-shirt's words on insurance
    t-shirt's statement:

    "tell me where i said the government will save all of us?"

    Very eloquent. You must be a liberal in government. Let's explore the context. This is a forum regarding the Health Speech. There are two items on the table, Private Insurance vs a Government Health Insurance/Care program (unless there is a third option involving little fairies emanating from the opposing end of your pie hole). Your original posting decried opposition to private insurance. That leaves you in the government plan camp.

    So tell me, without using further devious behavior typical of government entities and people like Obama. If not private insurance then what program are you pushing here? Otherwise, your empty words are correct but typical of the vile dishonest bull excrement from disgusting, vile, repugnant government slime you exemplify so well.
  • and yes, capitalism IS freedom
    Or more to the point, non-capitalism is non-freedom
  • tshirt doc - bad means to a good end
    "there is something i don't like about health care capitalism. its called scarcity. insufficiency or shortness of supply"

    We could build a functioning hospital on every city block for dirt cheap!

    First, we seize the land from whoever owns it, then we commandeer all the building materials from those who produced them, and then use slave labor to construct it. We can force the utility companies to provide the water, sewer, and electricity necessary to run the hospital. Then we can fill it full of doctors and pay them the same as the janitors. To keep the doctors from running off to some other place where they are paid according to the value they offer, we could build a wall around the hospital to keep them from escaping. Then would we be fair, just, and moral, or would we suddenly be just like East Germany?

    Please understand... a good intention is not noble if its fulfillment requires the violation of the property and freedom of others, and opposition to it does not automatically make someone into the heartless, greedy monster you portray them to be.

    p.s. do you think scarcity would not exist in a non-capitalist model?

    p.p.s. if diamonds were inexpensive, women wouldn't want them any more.
  • Joyce is Right
    Joyce -- We don't agree on much, but the link certainly seems to support your (and Wilson's) argument. I sure hope that Obama and the Dems don't introduce legislation to leagalize illegal aliens. I think that would be a big mistake on a number of levels. And, frankly, even though my wife is a naturalized citizen, I don't believe any government subsidized health insurance plan should be available for non-citzens, regardless of whether they are here legally or illegally. (I'm not saying they shouldn't get health insurance, but they should damn well pay for it themselves.)
  • Weew
    Capitalism IS freedom. you sure about that? what about those red chinese capitalists? they got their millions and billions the old capitalist ways.

    who told you that? the government? it sure does sound good. but its just only sounds.
  • Hey Newt Gingrich!
    If Nancy Pelosi should resign her position as Speaker because she dared to say the CAI misled her, what should Joe Wilson do for calling the President of the United States of America a liar?
  • T-shirt
    T-shirt are you a doctor? The reason we don't have more doctors is because it is hard to be a doctor, not because someone is controlling the supply.

    Also, I always hear you bashing Neal for calling himself a Libertarian and not staying in step with the party's official platform 100%. Have you glanced at the Libertarian stance on Healthcare lately?...hello pot this it's me kettle, you're black.
  • Wilson
    I don't have a problem with Joe Wilson's comments. Truth is truth. Nearly everything that comes out of Obama's mouth is lies or, at best, half truths. What I find laughable (and a little bit disturbing) is the story that simply because Obama made a pretty speech that most Dems are not getting behind him on this insane healthcare bill.
  • t-shirt doctor a lesson in Capitalism
    I left the reservation 35 years ago with nothing in my pockets. Because we are a Capitalist society, I was able to work hard and reap the rewards of that hard work. I was able to "endeavor to persevere." Sure I made mistakes. There was no safety net, much like growing up on a reservation. But today, I have children in college, WHICH I PAY FOR WITH MY OWN MONEY, NOT THROUGH SOME GOVERNMENT HAND OUT PROGRAM. Government handouts achieve one thing. They destroy a man's soul. Socialism is a loser's pursuit. Because of Capitalism, this is the nation with the largest heart when it comes to charity. What form of Communism do you know that gives to charity? I have employed other people and made certain that they were treated fairly. They could have worked for anyone else. We provided a great service and were paid for it.

    Capitalism provides a mechanism for exploring many alternatives and realizing the best result. I have seen plenty of able-bodied people just not work and receive their handouts from government. If you like socialism so much, why do you not move to France and leave the rest of us alone?

    I was ready to jump through the TV screen when Joe made his remark. He said what I wanted to say. How many liberals cheered when the shoe was thrown at Bush? How many liberals jeered at the inauguration? How many liberals published books and made movies on termination Bush when he was in office? Take your socialism and leave.
  • Democrats Boo Bush in State of the Union Speech
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2009/09/10/flashback_democrats_boo_bush_at_2005_state_of_the_union.html

    How do you know when a Democrat is lying?
    A - his lips are moving. yuck, yuck, yuck
  • Off the reservation
    Off the reservation, where did you mind go? do you even comprehend what the words mean when your reading them? tell me where i said the government will save all of us. i don't like government.

    i think you've got a screw loose.
    and i don't want you to put away your bad toys. you couldn't hit the side of a teepee even if you were standing inside it.
  • Joe was right.
    Regardless if you agree with his behavior, he was dead right. And Mr. Boortz, for someone who daily laments that the Republicans are too weak kneed to stand up to liberals, why are you bashing one who finally jumped forward? This is the kind of man the Republicans should make a hero out of. Heck, we all know the Democrats would if this were reversed. We finally get someone brave enough to speak what everyone needs to know. And you of all people are trying to call him out? Giving us this line about respecting the office? No, Mr. Boortz. You're wrong. When President Obama uses his office as a pulpit and spreads lies in every speech in order to reach a means of Socialism in America, he has demeaned the office. And the only way to stop the President himself is to call him out on it. Sure, Senator Joe Wilson was uncoshure in his tactic, but since when has that bugged you Mr. Boortz? Of absolute all people you should be proud of him. And yet you're antagonizing him? No, Mr. Boortz. You were right and the Republicans were wrong about the School Speech, which I am about as bored of hearing about as I am of hearing about Michael Jackson. But Senator Joe Wilson was telling the truth and his line, "You lie," was about the only honest line that was spoken in that hour. So don't give us this, "Classless rudeness," because he refused to respect another history making speech by President Obama but instead respected his constituents by letting them know he wasn't going to hear it. Besides, this was in no way an attack on the Presidential office. It was an attack on President Obama himself. He is accountable to the people, whether he thinks he is or not. So toss this line about rudeness Mr. Boortz and just remember you've been asking for Strong Republicans ever since I started listening to you 3 years ago.
  • Payoff to Big Labor
    Let's see if this points remain in the final draft. IF we ever get to see a final draft before they vote on it.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203440104574400571702189240.html
  • Wilson's Comments
    Well, I guess one can no longer call a spade a space in this country anymore.
  • it was
    the only true statement heard all night!
  • joe wilsons sign
    It was a rep from texas who had a sign that said "What Bill" not wilson with a sign with a sign that said "What Bull"
  • Nothing but a bunch of campaign speech LIES
    When is this president ever going to actually give a speech worth a flip instead of giving one no better than ones he gave prior to November 2008?

    Oh, and all those liberals in the media and in Washington drooling and slobbering over Wilson seem to have forgotten how Bush was treated:

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2009/09/10/flashback_democrats_boo_bush_at_2005_state_of_the_union.html

    Republicans should have STOOD UP and applauded last night. The time for being nice is over. This is SERIOUS business here these Dumocrats are attempting to ram down the majority doesn't want.
  • where is T-shirt doctor?
    T-shirt doctor, where did you go? Run home to mommy govt to get a battalion of soldiers to put the mean nasty Indian back on the reservation????

    This is a real invitation, T-shirt doctor. I will take you to my reservation and let you experience the essence of Government Health Care. I will gladly build the dug out for you. I will take you to a very safe mound, surrounded by miles and miles of water and saw grass. I will give you a metal spear tip and show you how to harvest a reed to use for spear fishing. I will show you how to render fish oil in a clay pot so you have mosquito repellent. There really is a richness of life here that you know nothing about. A richness taken from so many by the government in return for broken government promises and broken government laws for health care and education.

    Then I will take you to the clinic. You can see the health clinic all boarded up because the Indian Health Service ran out of money again back in May. You can stand there and wonder why the children die from TB when there are antibiotics to fight it but the govt cannot afford to treat them.

    Where did you go t-shirt boy? I want to hear your elitist opinions about the government saving all of us. I want you to experience how the government lives up to its treaties and abides by its federal law (look up Snyder Act of 1921, I am willing to help educate you). Come back T-shirt boy. I promise to put away all of my bad toys.
  • Crap
    Yes I did leave out the link Truth, thanks.

    http://www.timesunion.com/AspStories/story.asp?storyID=838269&category=OPINION

    This is an interesting group keeping track of immigration reform:

    http://www.fairus.org/site/PageNavigator/homepagenew
  • Joe Wilson
    I sent monry to Joe Wilson's re-election campaign. Thanks, Joe!
  • Go JOE
    So basically, Mr. Wilson was 100% correct. I'm sure a large number of Americans yelled it at their televisions, too, if not something worse. This has been the longest 9 months ever, and I can't wait to vote these morons out of office.
  • Joyce -- Did you leave something out?
    Joyce -- Was there supposed to be a link in your post? I'm not sure what you were referring to when you say there is supposed to be legislation next year.
  • Thanks, Joe Wilson
    "Rep. Joe Wilson's (R-S.C.) untoward outburst Wednesday night has had a positive effect for at least one person. Rob Miller, a Democrat planning to run against Wilson in 2010, has taken in more than $100,000 through the website ActBlue.com since his opponent heckled the president."

    And, Anonymous? The last Democratic president was convicted of lying? I must have missed that. Was it on MTV?
  • Weew
    Weew-- Well said!! Sounds like you've been reading Ayn Rand. If not, you should...you'd like her.
  • Plain Speaking Joe
    He simply said aloud what we all know to be true. I wish my Representative had a beanbag as sturdy as his.
    I'll be donating to his campaign today. I hope you will too.

    http://www.cafepress.com/Philosufism/6883171
  • Illegal alien health insurance
    I went to two town hall meetings and in each one the question was raised about who would be covered. Congressman Perriello from the 5th district said in each one I went to that they would be covered. I was up at the podium and I asked Illegal and he said YES... who's lying then??
  • profit motive
    Weew, i don't dislike the profit motive. except when peoples lives at at stake. and this is what i don't like about insurance companies.

    there is something i don't like about health care capitalism. its called scarcity. insufficiency or shortness of supply. we can build enough hospitals to wear every city has got more than one, or two, or three. wouldn't that be a good thing?
    not if your concerned with profits (that you won't make), than the lives of your fellow citizens. the scarcity is from the AMA who wants their doctors to make a salary above the average citizen. did you know that you could buy a diamond at the same price as a cubic zirconiom? that is if the diamond producers would let their entire inventory to make it to the streets. but the don't want to cut their own throats. so they hold them back, producing scarcity.
    health care scarcity is immoral. and we can't do anything about it, most people don't want to do anything about it, even though it will do then good.

    Off the reservation, i am neither a liberal or conservative. i have said for years that we should take the foreign aid dollars that we give to pakistan and egypt and give it to our reservations.
  • LOL@ webwench
    psssst booger
    first, you assume anyone listens to me. i agree, it should be bigger, more legible, something. if it were up to me, we'd use recaptcha so it would be doing some good.

    second, you can avoid the captcha by becoming a site member:
    http://tinyurl.com/mnh8sl
    if you're logged in, you don't get the captcha. ask joyce, she'll tell ya.
    By webwench

    --------------------
    Also, ignore the upper case lower case, the system will accept it either way!

    I swear I'm gonna go work for webwench!
  • Truthseeker (not)
    Really? Hmmmm, here we have Obama saying "I would anticipate that, before the year is out, we will have draft legislation along with sponsors potentially in the House and the Senate who are ready to move this forward and, when we come back next year, that we should be in a position to start acting," he said.
    ------------------------------
    So by the end of the year. Then this health care bill will cover them cause they will no longer be illegal.

    Thanks!!!
  • apologize???????????
    hell no ol' joe shouldn't apologize......he is speaking for the folks that put him there........

    all you politeasses need to let peeple that have the cajones to say sumpin' say it.......impolite not at my place....go JOE!!!!!
  • T-shirt
    T-Shirt said
    "gosh, your love of the health insurance companies is sorta of sickening to me. you got them up on their alter and kneel down and pray to them."

    Yes T-Shirt, I am one that thanks them for their product. My health insurer has kept me flush by paying for what I could not have afforded on my own, and I pray the government will stay out of the contract between myself and my insurance company.
  • emotional arguments are baseless and toothles
    "Within this culture, economics—not community well-being, not morals, not ethics, not justice, not life itself—drives social decisions."

    Just what is a "social decision"? Would such decisions deprive anyone of life, liberty, or property through force or fraud?

    Community well-being? Just who defines that, and what is its measure? And by what means will its whims be met?

    Morals? Ethics? As defined by what moral code?

    Justice? That is not to be defined and dispensed by the whims of the majority, and the plunder of one person for the sake of another is not justice.

    Life itself? That implies that one person's right to life relies on the denial of another's right to property. That is a sympathetic ploy to justify robbery and slavery.

    Capitalism IS freedom. Without it we are no longer free. Period.
  • Straight Cut to the Chase
    And I appreciate it. Good job buddy.
  • Speech
    I found it funny that Obama felt it necessary to take a poke at talk radio and Fox News last night. This guy is such an incredible child. God forbid oppose him. That said, T-Shirt Doctor, I have a question. Don't you sell T-Shirts for a living? Do you not do this business for profit? If you are, aren't you a tad hypocritical here?
  • webwench
    Thank you, I grovel at your feet. Neal needs to give you a raise
  • The GOP are cowards
    So Rep. Wilson disrespected the Pres.
    Since when does THIS Pres. deserve any respect. After all, he IS a liar AND a marxist.
    BTW, wasn't it equally rude of all the others making noise while the president was speaking just prior to Joes well deserved comment?
    Joe shoulda stuck to his guns and not apologised. It's the GOP that should be apologising to Joe for not backing him up.

    I for one will back him if need be.
  • @ Club-a- ..yawn.. pt 1
    Yesterday, you so eloquently said:

    "Forrest, I am getting pretty tired of you lecturing us and your elitist "I am so smart because I see both sides of the issue" crap. Based on what you have written (8 years old during Bush Sr), I take it you are in your mid-20's. Spare me your worldly knowledge. Experience life a few more years in the real world, and then get back to us."

    Well…Tthat kind of articulated genius simply cannot go without an acknowledgement of receipt.

    Elitist? You're one to talk. You come on here and put yourself on this soapbox, preaching to the choir. Disappointingly, you squander your efforts trying to bash one party when both are equally guilty of destroying our nation, just in different ways. This mentality/strategy is what perpetuates the two party system which is failing us, and that is what I have a problem with. You constantly use ‘we’ this and ‘we’ that… Are you a member of some kind of club which you speak on behalf of? I speak for myself and provide my own opinions, independent of a need to feel like I have a whole committee standing behind me. Referring to yourself as a plurality doesn’t augment the merit in your arguments, though if it makes you feel better, I’m not one to say you should stop.
  • @ Club-a- ..yawn.. pt 2
    Speaking to your age-bashing reference - I was born in 1980. I remember the kiddy newspaper (Weekly Reader) running articles on both Bush and Dukakis, even polling kids on who they'd vote for. This all under the glorious Reagan years... wacky politicians were trying to get to kids indoctrinated even then. I watched the Challenger disintegrate on live TV in a classroom. The Gulf war happened when I was 11 and I watched George Bush Sr. address children on TV in my classroom. I watched Clinton’s inaugurations, both of them, on televisions in my classrooms. I don’t have a problem including children in the politics of the present, otherwise they would be ignorant of their living history when they’re older, and this would further our youth’s ignorance of politics, which is why we have who we have in the Oval Office today. I was attempting to put myself in the mindset of a child watching a President speak, based on my recollection of what early childhood was like. It's called empathy, give it a shot, it helps you formulate better arguments instead of spewing talking points.

    I'm 29 years old. That is old and experienced enough to run for Senate in 2010, according to our wise founding fathers. If you've got a problem with people my age or younger, maybe you should stand in front of our military and tell them how inexperienced and unintelligent they are, simply because they haven’t reached whatever age you may be (assuming you’re older than mid-20’s). How quickly you forget that our nation’s independence was won by teenagers and men in their young 20’s. Europe was liberated TWICE by our servicemen who were mostly under 21 years of age. Kuwait and Iraq were both liberated by a volunteer military comprised of young Americans. Years don’t necessarily equate to wisdom, otherwise we’d have seen more than 51% of 60+ seniors voting for McCain, right? They sure don’t vote Libertarian... Care to bash them too?

    You'd be surprised at how much we agree on, I just don't care for your caustic delivery. Hell, even your name evokes a mild allusion to violence. I'm willing to use my first name, disclose my age and residency in these forums... you get to hide in anonymity behind a cute little sobriquet. Maybe that is a sign of maturity ...I think of it as dishonesty.

    Glad I could stir you up.

    Cheers.
  • liar
    I cracked up over Wilson's outburst. Classless, yes. Right on the money, hell yes.

    It really is difficult to sit there and listen to this guy tell lies like it's going out of style. I don't put up with it at work or in my personal life, so why should we put up with it from politicians, the lowest form of humanity? Besides, those bastards work for us.
  • Joe Wilson
    I have a ton of respect for the office of President of the United States. I have a great deal less respect for the current occupant of that office. OK, so Joe Wilson did what nobody else dared to do. It showed no class whatsoever. But damn, it needed to be done and I'm glad he did it. The look on the Princess's face was worth double the price of admission.
  • T-Short Doc, help me out
    If the profit motive is evil/immoral, could you please suggest a different motivation to work, produce, innovate, and serve? One that is more ethical and moral?

    Can you elaborate what part of your moral code is violated by profit and its pursuit?
  • I'M GLAD A REPUBILCAN
    FINALLY HAD THE BACKBONE TO SAY RIGHT TO HIS FACE WHAT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE HAVE BEEN SAYING FOR WEEKS AT THE TOWNHALL MEETINGS. TO WHICH THIS PRESIDENT HAS REFUSED TO HEAR. THE PRESIDENT RAN AWAY FROM THE AMERICAN PEOPLE SO THAT HE DID NOT HAVE TO LISTEN FROM THEM. IT WAS ABSOLUTLY PRICELESS TO SEE PERLOSI'S MOUTH DROP OPEN. IT AMAZED ME THAT HER STIFF FACE IS CAPABLE OF MOVING AT ALL. THIS OUTBURST WAS BAD MANNERS FROM THE CONGRESSMAN AND HE DID APOLOGIZE FOR IT, BUT IT WAS JUST AS BAD MANNERS FROM THE PRESIDENT FOR NOT ACCEPTING THE APOLOGY HIMSELF. HE LET HIS SECRETARY (RON) TAKE THE MESSAGE FOR HIM.
  • Health Care Crisis
    If as it seems this nation threatening crisis is as great as the left says we should take all the money being sent overseas as aid, about 22 billion in s 2006, and put it toward the our fellow suffering citizens. Would they do that? Didn't think so!
  • t-shirt doctor
    Very big words for someone who pretends to be on the side of people. There are plenty of liberals idiots like you out there that have had opportunities to fix government health and looked the other way. You do not fix anything. All you do is sit around with your well-dressed cigar-smoking wine-tasting liberal friends like many of the rich liberals that I see in Austin. Look to the wealth? You need only look in Austin to watch the liberal greed while they throw bread crumbs to the masses. You liberal jerks had many opportunities to fix things rather than carry on your chants and fancy speeches. I watched children and young adults dies on the reservation while you held your balls, talking about your high morals. Obama is a LIAR just like the rest of them. So come spend a year with on the reservation and get a real life lesson.
  • I just knew the GOP would manage to embarrass me last night.
    What’s an illegal alien? Everyone knows the only time the dp requires ID is to get into one of their town hall meetings.

    I’m a weirdo, I’ll watch British government in action every now and then and like it. They’ve learned how to keep people from falling asleep in there (insomnia? Try Cspan footage of the US Congress!), they actually debate the PM and each other, rather than just make boring speeches to themselves..

    Conservative guests on Mathew’s show should show up with a roll of paper towels. If I was one of his peers, even a friend, I’d never let him hear the end of it.

    Last night was typical hussein promising the sun, the moon, and the stars, imploring others to deliver it, with no details on how it could actually be done. That’s because it can’t, without the unacceptable downsides. That’s why they exempted themselves, tried to rush it through unread, scheduled it to take effect after the ’12 election, and directly contradict what they’ve long said about it trying to con us, and ram it through. That’s also why they are leaving so much of it to be filled in administratively or by committee. That smells a mile off, and you don’t have to see it to know what it is.
  • psssst booger
    first, you assume anyone listens to me. i agree, it should be bigger, more legible, something. if it were up to me, we'd use recaptcha so it would be doing some good.

    second, you can avoid the captcha by becoming a site member:
    http://tinyurl.com/mnh8sl
    if you're logged in, you don't get the captcha. ask joyce, she'll tell ya.
  • The British parliamentary political process during a presidential address of congress would be more welcome and hospitable than their health care system
  • Joe Wilson
    I was surprised to read/hear all the chatter this morning in reaction to Joe Wilson's "You lie!" moment. I even watched it again before writing this.

    Total time for his comment and the general reaction? Seven seconds.

    I didn't find that little seven second speed bump as much of an interruption as the 25 second standing ovation the President received just moments before when he debunked the death panels.

    If the general objection is that when there is a formal gathering of Congress everyone present should listen respectfully, do standing ovations have any place there either?
  • Joe Wilson
    Joe is the represenative for Beaufort County which is where Hilton Head Island is. I've heard Neal say that he loves to go throw down on Hilton Head. I like Joe Wilson alot. He is alot like a Jim DeMint in terms of being conservative and beleving in small government...just with a temper. I used to live on HHI, and was proud to have him represent me. If I still lived there, I would still be proud.
  • Wilson
    Joe Wilson is my newest hero. Said exactly what I was thinking when Big O made the comment.
  • Illegal Immigrants
    I have yet to find in any DEM healthcare bill a written provision that stipulates a person be asked or asked to prove citizenship as a condition of coverage. It is intentionally open-ended.
  • Obama'speech...
    that's all it was -- a speech for some face time. Why can't he wait until the work was closer to being done by the people responsible for doing the work have DONE the work. This man hasn't changed his stripes (sorry to all you tigers out there) since election -- his goals are still the same.

    20% truth, 10% wishful thinking, 30% deliberate deception, 40% bull.
  • No one has ever
    No one has ever called Bush a "liar", "idiot", "criminal" or booed him. Guess this was the first time that has ever happened?
  • there was a speech?????????????????
    how the hell did this happen.......I missed osamabamas speech?!?!?!?!

    it's ok tho' my buddies here at the boortz joint......hehehehehe.......sent me a copy.......I'll include it so you other unpatriotic sumbitches can reed it.......here 'tis.........

    blah blah blah, me me me me, lie lie lie lie, I I I I aaaaaaaah, uuuuuuuum, blah blah blah........

    did I git it rite??????????
  • Regretable Truth
    I agree that the illegal aliens will be covered. They are not insured and tend to be the most common abusers of emergency care from statistics (and experience) that I have seen. When I went to look at entitlement programs in North Carolina a few years back, over 90% of those applying did not speak English. This was in an area where about 10% were documented and undocumented immigrants.

    If ObamaCare did not cover those who are currently illegal immigrants then it would not address 10-20 million of the uninsured.

    That being said I believe that the outburst was honest, but regrettable and ill-advised. The impolite nature (interrupting a speaker) is commonly seen on talk shows, but is not common (unless affirmation, such as clapping) in this environment.

    Of course the mainstream media will focus on one audience member rather than the details, or lack thereof.

    That being said, the President does not write bills. Congress writes bills (works out the details).

    President Obama wants bipartisan support in much the way President Bush (or most people) want support. Everyone agree with me and we're good, right?

    Other than coverage of uninsured (saving money in emergency rooms, hopefully, through preventative care) I do not see how ObamaCare could result in better care at a lower price to the consumer. Some areas that could help (but may not be popular with Democrats):

    Competition between states (no mandates)

    Tort Reform (save on malpractice insurance, etc.)

    Individual tax breaks (not just employer-paid)

    Overhaul of Medicare/Medicaid, including preventing abuses.
  • Booger's Health Care Plan
    Pretty simple really
    1.Ban Lobbyists from DC
    2.Tort Reform, especially these ridiculous "punitive damage awards "
    3.Remove obstacles on health insurance companies so they can sell across state lines.
    4.Require insurers to offer an "alacarte
    menu of benefits" (I don't need maternity benefits since being a man, its harder for me to get pregnant)
    5.Offer several out of pocket deductibles to choose from until insurance kicks in, i.e 500/1000/2500/10000/year. Just like car insurance.
    6.Use all of the Savings from waste Prezbo claims is in Meicare,and give this money to County Health Depts to help hire more doctors,nurses and medicine for people making less than the poverty level.
    My plan is one page long not 1080

    PS Please webwench, I will you untold riches, if you would please change the security code provider
  • Joe Wilson
    He gets a standing ovation from me....I guess the Dims don't remember booing W during a State of the Union address. They amaze me with their outrage. As if Barry wasn't standing up there calling EVERYONE else a liar!!! OMG...I feel like I'm in the Twighlight Zone!!!!!!!!!!
  • health insurance companies
    gosh, your love of the health insurance companies is sorta of sickening to me. you got them up on their alter and kneel down and pray to them.

    yes i believe that health insurance companies will go under. why? because the owners will take their golden parachutes and live the high life somewhere else. its called downsizing to death. it's been done thousands of times. but of course, they don't have to. they can survive, all they have to do is give up their 100+ million dollar salary. but that won't happen. the 100+ dollar salary is what got him interested in that job anyway. who cares what product they make.

    oh, yeah. the profits that health insurance companies make. its the profit made by dead people.

    "Within this culture, economics—not community well-being, not morals, not ethics, not justice, not life itself—drives social decisions."

    that's capitalism for you. just thought i'd remind you of the seedier side of capitalism for you.
  • You Contradict
    Th system will not be funded by the tax base, but it will be run like state universites. They are funded by state taxes.

    You have to have health care just like in some states you have to have car insurace. Nope in no state in this country are you required to carry car insurance. You only *have to have* insurance if you choose to dirve.
  • Joe Wilson
    Joe Wilson spoke the truth, and if conservatives continue to play nice and be polite to those who are working to destroy us, we are soon going to lose our country.

    Once that happens, there will be no getting it back.

    EVER.

    Wilson should have then told John McClame to go pound sand. We may yet rue the day he didn't.

    -Dave
  • Just who is going to legalize the illegals?
    So Boortz thinks Barak Obama is going to legalize all the illegal immigrants in this country. And, pray tell, just how is he going to do that? When GWB floated the idea, it was completely shot down. Neither Obama nor the Democratic leadership has proposed any such plan. Do you really think they could get 60 senators to vote to legalize illegals?

    Of, I forgot. Boortz doesn't need facts, logic or reason to spout his conclusions.
  • Obama Speech
    Anyone reading the Atlanta newspaper would have seen where the Federal Govt can not effectively maintain the Vietnam Vets Memorial. Maintenence is being taken over by a vets group. This is the same govt wanting to maintain your healthcare coverage? Hell NO.
  • Go Joe!
    It wasn't classless, it was priceless, just like the look on Pelosi's face. Loved it. You should be more supportive of people calling Obama out.
  • why apologize?
    I don't think the "you lie!" comment was classless nor should he have apologized. For a brief moment in time the Repbulicans almost acted like they had a pair. We need more of this not less. More forcing of obama to explain the "plan" in public without a stacked house. And, without the aid of a teleprompter.
  • Joe Wilson
    Was he even able to walk out of there? I though he might have been incapacitated by the laser cannons coming out of Pelosi's eyes. Now THAT could lead a person to have the shivers...And though apology was sent to and accepted by the White House, I don't think Pelosi is done with him yet.
  • It may have been rude...
    but Joe was just telling it like it is...

    The funny thing is that Obama, like our friend "VOR" (name in quotes for obvious reasons)spends all day quacking, and then can't takes umbrage when someone calls him a duck.
  • sign
    i think the sign said "what bill"
  • We need more...
    Joe Wilson's out there. I don't care how rude he is to the people trying to ram this crap down our throats. All I saw last night was Barack Obama and his goon squad of elites give the American people the middle finger whilst smiling and rattling off more lies than I can even count. The reason Joe Wilson is so vocal is because HE knows where this is all leading. This NEVER had anything to do with helping people. It is a power grab for the New World Order elites. Taking over a country and converting it into a police state is a difficult process. They are in overdrive right now. Why are they in such a hurry? BTW watch this video and you will get an eyeful of what is ACTUALLY going on in this country.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzmBTrEfCTQ

    This kind of crap is happening EVERYWHERE. I have PERSONALLY had my 1st Amendment rights violated in a similar manner. Freedom loving Americans HAVE to stand up to this soft tyranny before it turns violent. The screwed up thing is that the Obama Administration is TRYING to start confrontations. If they get a nice little uprising and some violence that is their chance to lock things down more and more. That is why we have to square off with them and challenge them to follow the Constitution.
  • liberals are stupid nasty people
    Every liberal who wants government health care should spend two years on an Indian Reservation first, under Indian Health Care. I grew up under it. I'd be willing to wager 90% of those liberals would not survive the first two weeks. The Huffington Post has a nice article entitled "Promises, Promises: Indian health care needs unmet" There is nothing in this bill or Obama's speech that addresses the carnage on Indian Reservations thanks to Government Health Care.
  • sign
    i think the sign said "what bill"
  • The Evil Profit Motive
    Could one of the lefty posters help me with this?

    If the profit motive is indeed illegal and/or immoral, what would be a suitable alternative motivation to get out of bed and work, innovate, serve?

    The goodness of one's heart?

    Force?
  • sign
    i think the sign said "what bill"
  • classless rudeness when a conservative is speaking on a college campus.
    Or, Liberals booing President Bush during a State of the Union Address. Come on Neal we all know you were thinking Barry was a liar when he said no coverage for illegals.
  • Scare tactics
    Your comment about who's using scare tactics is so true...
  • Boortz Logic
    Hey Boortz, why are you so upset about the speech?

    Using your logic from yesterday regarding the education speech, I'll take a page from your book: "How does it feel to be played like a fiddle? Well .. he stuck to the script, and by last evening the people who had been in such a panic over the president's HC reform and public option and death panels and coverage for illegals were looking, shall we say, foolish. It was actually a very strong event for Obama. He flat out said illegals won't be covered, didn't commit to public option, and there is no such thing as death panels, and in the meantime, you look foolish for fearing the speech."

    Nothing to worry about, Neal, huh???
  • Republicans do it themselves
    Not only do republicans hate their kids listening to the President of the United States, but they also elect people that interrupts him.
    I wonder why republicans even want to live in America when there are plenty of countries where the President cares less about the education of the children and where coups are running wild throughout.

    My favorite future argument is that the crybabies will say the media is biased. Ha, if you think the media is so biased, then quit crying, grow a pair, and change the channel
  • Joe Wilson's comment
    Someone has to point out the obama is lying. The msm won't do it. Certainly the dems won't do it.
    Interesting that after 8 years of people comparing the president to hitler, now, some people are upset that this president who has a track record of lying (he just hasn't been convicted of it like the last dem president), gets called on it. I stand with Joe Wilson--LIAR!!! LIAR!!!
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