Now the Great One is concerned about failing schools? This is not a Presidential priority. Nor is being concerned about credit card companies and how they do business. Whenever an upper manager starts to "micromanage" everything in sight it is a sure sign that he/she is insecure and is failing as a manager.

How we have to allow President Obama to do what we elected him to do. 100 days to fix 8 years of Bush economic disaster is pretty good. Let's see what he can fix next. http://www.communalprosperity.net

More pay for Teachers? I would be in favor of this if they would do away with their pension plans. What most people don't realize is that most public school teachers are part of a state retirement plan. This is a huge benefit, that the vast majority of American workers don't receive, and costs a great deal each year (though most gov't employes receive this type of benefit)

Each state is a little different, but I will use FL as an example. For each year worked, a teacher gets roughly 1.63% of their highest 5 year average salary. So a teacher who retires after 30 years would get approx 47.9% of their salary, with a 3% coli and "free" healthcare for the rest of their life. The average teacher with 30 years in is bringing in roughly 52k per year. That means that a teacher that started work right out of college at 24, retires at 54 and receives $24,908 which grows at 3% annually for the rest of their life. There are also spousal benefits they can elect.

When you take this into consideration, their package is not nearly as poor as many make it out to be.

Teaching salary summary page for the state of Florida
Salary range: $32,879 - $59,138

Average teacher salary: $45,296

Average beginning teacher salary: $30,700

Median household income: $42,433

Median house price: $189,500

Per-Pupil Spending: $6,056

Cents spent on benefits for every dollar paid as salary: 25.2¢

Actually the NCLB bill does have a provision where the LOCAL (note the local copy) education agency can decide to contract out parts or all of the education process.

hmmm, stop taking all federal funds, let each state hire their own contractors, no more unions.....

Then we can go about the business of dismantling the teacher's unions. Then and only then can the miserable failure that public "education" has become be properly addressed.

Until then, the U.S. will continue its dramatic slide in world educational rankings, creating a permanent underclass of black and hispanic children utterly incapable of competing in today's knowledge-based economy.

Facts? Here they are, courtesy of a VERY recent McKinsey report:

http://www.mckinsey.com/clientservice/socialsector/achievement_gap_report.pdf

Right you are! My bad. Now I have an idea who it might have been....

I think I did it once too, the bad taste in your mouth goes away, eventually!!!

The thing he missed is that we don't have to submit to their "rule" unless we take the funds. So we could just quit taking them!

hey! I have an idea. with so many schools suffering from lack of money due to dumbasses not being able to form a budget here is a way to help them out.

get rid of the superintendent, assistant superindentent,assistant assistant superintendent, assistant assistant assistant super........I hope you see where this leads. If the top guy is making $140,000+/- there is some new school books, if the assist. makes $70K there is the new______.

when i started jr. high that was the first time we had to supply our own paper, pencils etc. i don't ever remember a teacher having to supply us.

as for deadwood teachers, don't think we had any, maybe they didn't have a union back then. Stanford class of '65. does this turn on any lil' light bulbs out there??????

"Umm, because they're PRIVATE, Neal. They don't get public funding because they're private schools. Sheesh."

So by what authority does the government have to hire private contractors for ANYTHING?

I suppose this all falls back to the idea that we should use contracts to dole out everything. To receive PUBLIC funding, you should sign a government contract. All the standards of compliance to receive this money would be explained in detail. No sneaking in ex post facto provisions either!

And Copyleft, you say the President can create any cabinet level positions he wants, ehh? So, what is stopping the President from creating the Department of Blogging, with a secretary who oversees all comments posted on the blogs? Just because you can create a sock puppet doesn't immediately grant the sock puppet any real authority. There is no authority until someone accepted a little government money to keep their blog afloat.

Thanks Copyleft for agreeing with me that the #1 message in all of this is to STOP TAKING GOVERNMENT MONEY! It screwed Chrysler, GM, public schools, state governments, and anyone else it has touched. Only take government money if you have a nicely written contract in front of you that is enforceable in court, and has a date of expiration.

We just need to get the government to stop giving away money it has no right to dish out.

What exactly is Barry's definition of 'failing'? Does a school fail if it doesn't adhere to Marxist philosophy? Doesn't indenture itself to the Federal Government instead of the local district it represents?

People squealed over 'No Child Left Behind' and the standards it sought, what will make Obama's 'standards' any better?

Instead of PROVIDING education for our K-12 children, why not simply have government do what it does best... i.e. provide funding for education.

Government is really good at taking money from one group of Americans and giving it to another group of Americans. Government should be the FUNDING SOURCE for education instead of a VENDING SOURCE. Government already efficiently provides funding for dozens of other services via housing vouchers, food vouchers, medical service vouchers, etc... So why on earth do we demand that government actually PROVIDE educational services for our kids instead of simply paying for that service?

A voucher and tax credit system would be the best way to pay for educating our kids. Let the free market choose which schools, which curriculum, how many hours, school days, etc are provided. The whole world can't all have a liberal arts degree! Whatever happened to "apprentice" training programs for brick layers or plumbers, or electricians or auto mechanics?

I hate to say this, but I agree with you on one point. When you said "submit to government standards and requirements on curriculum, testing, admissions, and disability services."

Still, I don't think that government has to infect the institutions that accept the vouchers.

...I can't believe
I agreed with anything
Copyleft said...

You're right...there are some lousy teachers out there and I certainly didn't mean to defend them all. I agree that more money isn't going to help the current teachers, but I think if the teaching role came with more pay, you'd have better people studying to be a tacher. For example, I would habe liked to be a teacher, but I didn't really consider it because I knew I would never be able to give my children the life I wanted them to have on a teacher's income - I became a chemical engineer instead. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE my job, but I wonder how many smart people shy away from teaching for the same reason.

And I completely agree with the need for discipline!

You could fire every teacher and principal in the country and replace them. It wouldn't make a damn bit of difference as long as the teachers unions have their strangle-hold on the process. They don't give a damn about educating our children. They are only concerned with obtaining, maintaining, and wielding political power. Unfortunately, that power is over our children. Never have I seen a tyrany so petty and mean-spirited as that I suffered through in government schools.

Why are vouchers a bad thing?

Vouchers would be offered to the PUBLIC (who are actually funding the government) to offer the PUBLIC tax payers money to choose how to educate their children.

What is your problem with this? These are PUBLIC tax payers that just want to offer their children the best education they can.

I guess you don't have children - and you aren't a homeowner who pays property tax. Anyone who pays property tax sees that a huge chunk of it goes to funding Public education. Parents who are really paying attention to their childs education can see that the children are not getting what they need from Public schools. Everytime I see the portion of my property tax that goes to public schools I am more and more supportive of vouchers.

Since I attended a Public school, I can tell you first hand that if it were not for my parents teaching me how to read (and the strong desire to learn) before I ever attended Public school, I might never have learned to read. There are many children who they say "slip through the cracks" and actually graduate from Public school never learning how to read. The Public school systems within each of our states is horible. You can brag all you want about different states being better. None of them are good. AND they are much worse since I completed my government schooling.

When I was in public school, the one thing that I can say I strongly benefitted from was the physical education. We had PE every day. Today, the kids are lucky if they have PE a couple of times a week. It's crazy that they don't realize that this is important. Instead of getting physical exercise - now they put them on drugs. I took my son out of Public school and home schooled him. It would have been so nice to be able to access some of the tax dollars I paid out in the form of vouchers to suppliment the matterials I had to teach him. I still did a much better job than the Public school system does... and my son didn't have to go on behavior modification drugs and he isn't a lard-ass either!

First off, I read my last post and I have a typo there. So, please spare me the response.

HOPE scholarship is a classic! To me scholarship means you are the elite, better than the reat, and you get awarded a scholarship to go to a college. With our HOPE "scholars", because of wonderful grade inflation, we have our SCHOLARSHIP students going to college and being forced to take remedial english and math!!! Many read at the 9th grade level and they got a scholarship! WTF.

Imagine if they handed out athletic scholarships the same way. Johnny is capable of making 5 out 15 layups on a good day. Well, I think he deserves a basketball scholarship.

We constantly hear the left and OBozo say "We need everyone to go to college." What?? We have too many kids go to college. That is why a college diploma now is the equivalent of HS diploma 40 years ago. There used to be a sense of achievement and pride to have a college grad in the family or neighborhood. Now, any moron who can add 2 plus 2 on the majority of the days, can go to college. What does that to the value of a college diploma?

I often volunteer in low income areas as a Junior Achievement volunteer in schools, after school programs at the local boys and girls clubs, and Habitat for Humanity. Unfortunately, it’s not the schools or the teachers that are failing these kids... it’s their parents. Sorry, but the majority of the FUBU wearing, Xbox owning community is living off our tax dollars. Their children are growing up in households that do not teach or comprehend concepts like "work ethic", "respect", or "earn". No wonder the teachers seem to be failing...why should these children learn to read, write, or speak with proper grammar? They don't have to get jobs. All these kids need to know they learned from their parents years ago – put your hand out and the government will take from others who earned it and you can pretend you deserve it. Repeat after me "gimme mine's". Seriously, there are 7 year olds who know how to separate the groceries based on what you can use food stamps on (oh, sorry – “Independence Cards”… you know, for those DEPENDANT on the government). With democrats in charge, the freeloaders are going to get more and more. Feel free to sit on your government paid for porch all day and do nothing, kids. It apparently pays pretty well.

There are still those of us in the world who believe in PERSONAL accountability - those of us who work hard to be able to have things we want. Unfortunately, we are not going to be so motivated if this continues... For you liberals who want teh govenment to have control over everything, go into a DMV near any major city. As you are waiting for the underqualified and overpaid clerk to get off her cell phone and attend to the massive line of people (aka DO HER JOB!!!) note how efficiently its operated? Yep, lets let the government run more things like this...

I have yet to see what will happen to the principals and teachers from the closed schools. Since they will all undoubtedly have tenure, they will simply be shuffled around to other schools to continue their failing ways.

How does this help solve anything? It's like a baseball team saying, "our 3rd starting pitcher is performing horribly, so we are moving him to the 4th starter spot and that will solve the problem." No it doesn't, you still have a horrible pitcher.

It's like Walmart saying, "we have an employee who is horrible. They are always late and won't help customers. Therefore, we are moving them from clothing to electronics. Now the problem is solved."

One more question comes to mind, other than the obvious one Neal already asked (where does he get this type of power?). As long as you rank things, there has to be, by definition, something on the bottom. Someone HAS to be the worst performing out of a group.

Will Obama just keep on closing down the bottom 1% every year ad nauseum?

Ramblingman
southernramblings.blogspot.com

CopyLeft - As Ben Dover points out, why form a federal department for education. The fact that it was created under Jimmy "I live dictators" Carter tells you everything you need to know.

It is amazing how since this country was founded there was never a need for this Dept of Education. Suddenly, the moron Carter in the late 1970's decides we need it. How did we make it all those years without it?

To top it off, take a look at the level of intellectual firepower coming from your average teenager these days. The kids were much smarter back then. Today, they are a like, you know, soooo behind in like math, and english, and like other subjects, and can barely put a like coeherent sentence together. We have graduated a bunch of walking mouthbreathers.

go to the link Neal posted "I quit, I think"

http://educationrevolution.stores.yahoo.net/iquit.html

One huge advantage private schools have is that they can kick out students. Public schools cannot do that. It doesn't matter if they crossed the Rio Grande yesterday, or if they are about as house trained as a puppy, public schools have to take them, and then the Federal Gov't expects them to be on grade level. I'm not excusing public education of any responsibility, but at some point, shouldn't parents be held accountable for their child's education to some degree?

You can not have it both ways. Chrysler was a privately held company. Funny I think the got taxpayer money. Or am I mistaking?

I guess if any one but the President announced this radical idea it would have been seen as great by the right. I stop by this page just to see what some folks think. I really used to enjoy Neal's show for years. This is truly the Anti-Obama Show, now. Do you have to search for the negative spin on Obama's every move or does it come naturally? As for as power grab, anytime you take money from someone you have to dance to their music. That's why private schools are able to do what they do.

I've heard of the Department of Education, but what EVER gave the federal government the authority to form this department? Just because the feds have seized this power does not mean they have it legally. Maybe they do, that's why I ask the question. And I did look at the Constitution along with the preamble, bill of rights and amendments, but I have a job and can't surf the internet all day. I'm sure there is someone on this site who can point me in the right direction.

Maybe you can tell me where in the constitution it gives the federal government any authority to be involved in the education of our citizens.

So you agree that we should not be giving money to private business as well?

I like the closing of government schools...it's just the reopening that I have trouble with...

So we have people who honestly don't know that funding and control over public schools operates at all three levels--local, state, AND federal?

People who've never heard of the Department of Education? People who think that their local public school is controlled entirely by the local school board? Geez, are these people ignorant of the No Child Left Behind FEDERAL law?

C'mon, folks. Do some reading. OF COURSE the federal government has the power to set standards and control funding for public education. It always has, since public education was first established!

Seeing this much ignorance on display from the rabid right is just sad.

(1) You should know by now that what OBozo says and does are 2 different things. He says what he thinks people want to hear (which curiously is always the opposite of typical lib dogma), in this case, shut down failing schools. That sounds good, doesn't it? I mean, who wouldn't agree with that concept. However, do you actually think that he actually means it? He is owned by the teacher's unions. Give me a freakin break. This will never happen, so he throws it out there and ends up in a win-win situation - he looks like he is tough on failing govt schools, but knows that there is no chance this will happen, much to his delight. Just like OJ offering a reward to find his wife's killers.

OBozo does this all the time. It's funny how libs are so afraid of telling people their real beliefs and ideas. They have to pretend they are not libs. In other words, tehy themselves know that the average person doesn't agree with them on issues, so they have to trick them every election and pretend they are not libs.

(2) "Here's an idea, Obama ... ever heard of a voucher or a private school?" Where have you been, Neal? Of course he heard of it. Over 1,700 kids in DC, who were in these pathetic putrid gov't schools, got vouchers to attend the very special private schools that Obama's spawn go to. He took those vouchers away. Those kids are forced to go back to the failing schools. After much uproar, OBozo agreed to extend the voucher program that pays for low-income children to attend private school in DC, BUT only until the current enrolled students graduate. Think about that...why only until the current ones graduate? If it is good for the current 1700 kids, why not continue it? So, let the other kids in the future continue to rot in these failed govt schools.

If this happens (which it wont) I would venture to say that they will find that the majority of the failing schools are in lower income areas and run/populated by minorities.

If they have not already thought of that, they will have to notice it later and then they will have to back off from their plan because it will become a race issue.

Please this is the ever expanding role of the Federal government into our lives. Our states and local governments have sold us out for Federal funding and have become administrative arms of the bloated Federal bureaucratic machine. If you want to see our fate in a few years, look at our friends in the UK and shudder.

I have to disagree with Neal on this one....the failure of the schools is more likely due to the extremely low caliber of students rather than the work ethics of the staff. The ACLU and others have long since taken away the schools' ability to control their students. They should close the schools and re-open them as juvenile detention facilities and let the so called students sit in lock-up for 8 hrs a day...that way they will at least have some training for their future careers.