This "pirates" nonsense is just a politically correct way to describe typical Black/African thugs, just like the ones in Atlanta. What total bull.

We don't have any nuke powered surface ships left with the exception of the aircraft carriers.

But more importantly let's be real about this. This is a huge story about practically nothing. A bunch of thieves got onboard what must be one of 10,000 ships on the water. The Navy can't protect that, nor is it really useful to put deck guns on commercial ships. That ship you see's main job is to protect the aircraft carrier, shoot down airplanes, and launch tomahawks.

If we were truly that worried about this we've got some patrol craft that could do the trick with the right guns onboard. The realistic thing to do is negotiate this guys' release, arrest the punks right afterwards (or kill them, whatever). Then next time you intel the area next time one of our merchants goes through, then have an F/A-18 use it for target practice with a 20mm cannon.

This could even be another use for a predator drone.

The only ships in the U.S. Navy that are nuclear powered are submarines and aircraft carriers.

All US flagged vessels traveling through pirate waters should be required to be armed. Vessels over 1500 tons should have at least 2 Mk38 Mod2 mounts (same 25mm chain gun our Bradley’s use, the USSS Bainbridge has two), or better. They are relatively cheap, pretty easy to install or remove, require little space and power, are stabilized, remote operated, and very effective on anything under 2000 yards. With DU rounds it can punch through T-64 armor. Then put the message out, stay further than 2000yds from merchant ships off the Somali coast (or wherever) unless you want to die.

I like Q Ships, they are poetic justice, and making piracy a more dangerous occupation will decrease its’ popularity, but if you want to end a varmint problem you take out the nest. That’s why pirate ports are legal target ranges.
Sounds like damifino heard how the KGB quickly stopped the kidnapping of Russians in Beruit after just three kidnappings, and at the cost of one Russian life. They understand the terrorist mentality, in no small part because they trained most groups’ original cadre.
Christy ACB, the first 6 frigates built for the US Navy were built to protect US merchant shipping in the Med from the Barbary Pirates. I wonder if you would really be okay with armed merchantmen (nothing new there), or Exxon shelling Somali ports? It’s not an either or choice, countries can and have done both.
I notice you made no mention of it being an occasion to reduce Somali males to 10% of the population (males are 100% of the Somali pirates) and breeding the rest for docility (even though they are the poster children of all you claim to abhor). I guess that fantasy is just for American men like Neal, and the males from your admittedly “mythical 50’s.”

Unfortunately for this late, once-geat country we have a president who will not take a stand or make a decision. Look at his Senate record. He is too busy campaigning as president of the World to protect American citizens.

According to what I heard today on Limbaugh, piracy is an international crime against mankind. Google for more info. Why have these pirates not been eliminated? Obama sucks!

Jake, shotguns are good for clearing the deck, but a few machine guns come in handy no matter what a pirate's religion. I think enough firepower is called having suppressive and area denial capabilities by the military guys.

I was going to correct the photo and also what Neal posted about a nuclear powered ship since the Bainbridge is not nuclear powered... but another Navy Chief beat me to it!

Just saw your next post!!! LOL

Yep on the shotgun!

Oh and one more thing, Joyce M/Blythe - I agree with "Blow them out of the water". It is only the fear of retribution that ends piracy, just as a good shotgun ends a home invasion.

How do we know that the SEALs are NOT in area? Ummm, I can see the announcement from the Navy- "Our anti-terrorist SEAL Team is underneath your ship right now, in their SDV's, so give up!" I say, that they are positioned and waiting to the go on the op. Let the negoiators do what they can so. If they can not release the captain, then we know who can do something later that night.

She seems to be new to the forum and new to the use of reason and logic. Matter of fact I don't think anyone on this forum is quite as stupid ....and considering copyleft and hugo that says a lot.

I can't even think of anything to say in rebuttal to her ascertion that the military shouldn't intervene in a capitalist venture (read piracy on the high seas)... her statement is so inane as to limit retort to simple pity for her obvious lack of brain function. No wonder Obama won. So many people like her who think "Change" is a policy and "Hope" is a legitimate government activity.

Well done. You've said all that needs to be said in the fewest words.
You can always count on a goat to get the job done.
How about giving some lessons to the Idiot-in-Chief?

I guess you can't vote present on this one.

He wouldn't even take question on this today from the press. The new motto must be "ignore it and it will go away".

Listening to the show, Neal had a good point, even if these pirates are just doing it for the money, where do you think that money ends up???? And the majority of piracy right now IS extremist Muslim. The non-Muslim attacks are questionable if you follow the money. Where does it go? As was said, "they ain't building themselves any mansions with the money".

Blow them out of the water, I don't care.

Re: Christy ACB "The military does NOT interfere with capitolist endeavors. "
BTW, that's capitalist.
You mean kind of like how the Navy didn't interfere with US commercial coastal shipping along the Atlantic coast being sunk by U-Boats in the 1940s?
And, come to think of it, like how the USCG didn't interfere then either, right?

Piracy is not solely a “Muslim” problem, but exists were it is profitable for anyone to turn to the crime without fear of retribution. Piracy actively exists not only along the sea lanes near Somalia, but in other areas of the world. Pirates actively prey on the weak off the coast of South America, the Malacca Straits, West Africa, the coast of Bangladesh, and the South China Sea - all these are active hotspots. Even with the Somali piracy, many of these pirates operate in areas outside of the Jihadist controlled areas like the so called “friendly government” controlled coast of Putland. Please do your research!

The other Rick with a few comments after reading through those already posted -

Initials are actually BHO - Bend HUMBLY Over

This country's doctrine concerning this issue was well established early on and was first carried out on "the shores of Tripoli"

we might do well to refrain from wishing for military action from this administration in light of the results achieved by recent Commanders-in-Chief of this one's party affiliation

Don't worry so much. The Secretary of State has already issued a strongly worded and unambiguous statement to the effect that some sort of world action may be called for. It'll soon be OK

Four pirates holding one American?
Easy.
Four well placed sniper rounds.
One American and four snipers return to bar for round of drinks and some good laughs about a job well done.

I may be wrong but I think the Old Soviets had the right idea in handling terrorist and pirates. What ever else you can say about them they didn't put up with any crap from Islamic terrorist and had very little problems with them until after the breakup of their states and economic woes(sound familiar? we are on the same path)The USSR would have even won in Afganistan if not for the US supporting the Taliban.Speak softly and carry a big stick works WHEN it is used and always has.

Time to call the UN so they can say 'Bad pirates, bad-bad pirates, don't do that again'

Can we bring back the concept of the Q-ship? A merchant ship with a whole lot of hidden firepower. They sail around waiting to be boarded and then ... they say pirates make great chum.

"This government wants Perdicaris alive or Raisuli dead." Ahhh good ol’ Teddy Roosevelt. Those were the days when governments knew how to fight piracy by taking their crimes to their front doors. Nowadays to respond against piracy with force is to face international condemnation, just ask the Indian Navy after they sank a Thai trawler being used by Somali pirates. The answer to the piracy problem is not only having navel patrols, but commissioning some old fashioned Q-boats (false armed merchant ships used as decoys). Pack a few 30-mm chain guns and 12.7-mm anti-material rifles aboard and when the pirates attack surprise! The other is to pursue the pirates back home and destroy everything that floats in the village harbor. I know that that can be seen as cruel, but most of these pirates are fishermen who turned to piracy for the profit (and no Neil not because of their religion). Sink the whole community’s fishing vessels and the signal will spread down the Somali coast like wildfire that you better make sure your village stops piracy before it can begin.

Christy wrote:
"Or do you want quasi-government sponsored money making ventures where ultimately, the military becomes the enforcement arm"

WHAT? So what your saying is that if the police come to rescue of a business, then local goverment now gets a peice of your business.

MeisterVT, so what your saying is that we should just keep paying them off and everything will be fine? Just the price of doing business in that area? Geeez! Talk about the price of goods going up.

Like so many other things in the world, some of you don't have the courage to deal with the problem. Lets say that we pay them, then what do you say when they start killing people to get their money quicker.

Some of you make me sick, as long as its not your stuff they steal, then its ok and we should find a peaceful solution. I have a solution, why don't we make the penalty out way the gain? Maybe convince them to, oh I don't know, work to make their country better? I don't know too many the U.S. has turned down if they really want help.

You want to stop this, then every time they send a gang out to hijack a ship, make sure that gang dose not return home. Trust me it won't take long for them to figure out that the price for the one way ticket is too high.

I hope I never raise my hand to another human being, but if provked I will defend myself vigorously.


THIS JUST KEEPS GETTING FUNNIER!

Class and type: Arleigh Burke class destroyer
Displacement: 9,200 tons
Length: 509 ft 6 in (155.3 m)
Beam: 66 ft (20 m)
Draft: 31 ft (9.4 m)
Propulsion: 4 General Electric LM2500-30 gas turbines, two shafts, 100,000 total shaft horsepower (75 MW)
Speed: 30+ knots (56+ km/h)
Range: 4,400 nautical miles at 20 knots
(8,100 km at 37 km/h)
Complement: 270 officers and enlisted
Sensors and
processing systems: • AN/SPY-1D Radar
• AN/SPS-67(V)2 Surface Search Radar
• AN/SPS-64(V)9 Surface Search Radar
• AN/SQS-53C Sonar Array
• AN/SQR-19 Tactical Towed Array Sonar
• AN/SQQ-28 LAMPS III Shipboard System
Electronic warfare
and decoys: • AN/SLQ-32(V)2 Electronic Warfare System
• AN/SLQ-25 Nixie Torpedo Countermeasures
• MK 36 MOD 12 Decoy Launching System
• AN/SLQ-39 CHAFF Buoys
Armament: 1 x 32 cell, 1 x 64 cell Mk 41 vertical launch systems, 96 x RIM-66 SM-2, BGM-109 Tomahawk or RUM-139 VL-Asroc, missiles
1 x 5/62 in (127/62 mm), 2 x 25 mm, 4 x 12.7 mm guns
2 x Mk 46 triple torpedo tubes
Aircraft carried: 2 x SH-60 Sea Hawk helicopters

(from Wiki)

I was involved in the planning to take down a NK ship bringing arms to the middle east in late '80s. The first thing asked is "can we do this legally?" IOW get the lawyers involved. Turned out we could, but the ship ran into "difficulties" prior to its destination. We did, however, follow it all the way across the IO, just over the horizon.

Fast fwd to now. We (and several other countries) are wearing out very expensive ships and using large amounts of fuel for this mission. These ships are armed with the most expensive and capable afloat arms, all unusable against 3rd world thugs, armed with clubs in beat up boats. It's unbelievable we have allowed ourselves to get into this position.

My take (never get past planning for sure):
- Pirates take ship
- Air lift SEALS to ship
- Kill ever pirate except one.
- Shoot remaining pirate in kneecap.
- Place wounded pirate in boat and point him towards shore.
- Repeat as necessary.
- Two weeks later, problem over.
- All military ships return to normal operations.

Are we ever going to understand that these clowns only really understand a poke in the eye with a sharp stick.

BTW, the SEALS train for ship take-downs.

Seriously... Um... what happened to the guns. I mean... aren't we supposed to have big ones on ships like that ;)

(yeah... I know... missile ship. The point is still the same.)

ChristyACB - as far as this ship being privately owned - the crew is entirely American. Does anyone wonder why a foreign owned merchant ship is flying the American flag,and has an American crew, which are more expensive? Also, according to news reports, the crew gained control over weapons bearing pirates without any weapons of their own. The report also states that the second in command graduated from the Mass. Maritime Academy in 2001, and was trained in firearms and small-arms tactics.

A search reveals that this ship is part of the maritime security fleet under contact since 10/1/2005.

The Maritime Security Program (MSP) forms the third stage of cargo support for US war operations. Vessels pressed into the programme form a "third-resort" fleet made up of US-flagged commercial vessels, which are paid subsidies each year to participate. If called upon, these vessels would become dedicated cargo carriers for a US war effort.

Looks like the pirates chose the wrong ship - or did they? Perhaps they are testing our anti-military president.







As

Reggie - you said "the acts of the etremist are comdemned but the islamic majority." I'm sorry but does anyone else hear crickets?
ChristyACB - First, one of the reasons for a navy is to protect merchant shipping. Second - this country has long advocated for the freedom of the seas, and using the Navy to aerate these pirates would be consistent with that policy. Third - it is the law that Federal Troops can't be deployed in the United States without the permission of the state in question. This helps to stop the whole dictator/military coup issue. Finally - the military always has, and always will be, the enforcement arm of capitalism. Would you rather privately owned and operated militaries, acting in the best interests of the investors and not the US? What happens when Sears lauches a raid on the local Macy's because they don't like the sale prices at the other store?

What Christy?? The mission of the Navy has always been to protect the freedom of the seas. That includes protecting merchant vessels, whether they carry cargo or passengers.

Neal - Absolutely; SEAL's are probably on standby and the Bainbridge is there to supply operational support (swim platforms and recovery ops); However can you confirm what I heard on FOX that MAERSK (sp) has asked that the US Navy NOT intervene? That, if its true, has got to be the biggest copout I've ever seen. MAERSK has a veritable fleet of ships, and ransoming this captain will bode ill for them. Let the Frogmen go, rescue the captain, keep your money and let the Somali thugs know that messing with US interests and citizens will not be tolerated. Oh, Wait....Maybe Obama will walk on water and "talk" to them about it....

Neal,

First, the ship out there is a Gas Turbine powered destroyer. 4 LM2500's I believe and nothing at all nuke about it. Second, that is a retired ship in the pic..hello!

Also, this merchant vessel is just that: A privately owned merchant vessel. Capitolism at work. The military does NOT interfere with capitolist endeavors. Should the navy charge in and harm civvies in the process, the left would have a field day. We couldn't even go into Katrina zones until ASKED by the state.

So decide. Do you want unfettered capitolism and the RISK that comes with it? Or do you want quasi-government sponsored money making ventures where ultimately, the military becomes the enforcement arm.

You decide.

I think they need to revisit the law that prevents a vessel from having arms to protect itself. This is getting ridiculous.

Minor point, but the only nuclear powered Naval vessels currently serving are aircraft carriers and submarines.

Really I think a good way to go right now would be "look, release him and we let you go. Kill him and you die. Refuse and the one place you won't be going is back to Somalia."

The only reason they haven't really harmed many people yet is that they know if they hold out long enough they get paid. Just outright killing them will only make future pirates of American vessels more apt to just kill hostages and then leave if it doesn't look like a ransom is being paid.

It seems you want to go in there to "Show our stregnth" but wouldn't the more important thing be to get the guy out ALIVE? Not worried about that as much are you. Now to you harping on this MUSLIM issue, it's rediculous and only inspires hate, There are MILLIONS of law abiding muslims and the acts of the etremist are comdemned but the islamic majority.

The ship in the photo provided is that of the "old" USS Bainbridge, hull number CG-25, which was decommissioned in 1996. The ship now confronting the pirates is instead the "new" USS Bainbridge, DDG 96, of an entirely different class (make/model if you will).

We need a Teddy Roosevelt moment (specifically the Perdicaris incident) where Obama says "Return him alive and unharmed or we will have dead Muslim Pirates." No questions, no negotiations. Just a statement of fact. That is if he is willing to take this on.

While muslim extremism is a true and growing threat, I think in this case the pirates aren't capturing ships and kidnapping foreign crews to convert them to Islam or as part of a "maritime jihad". They're just pirates-chasing booty on the high seas.

Now, if only the US had some sort of elite commando unit who was trained to retake assets and rescue hostages. A group who can operate in sea/air/land.......

Obama will do the same as he did with the Korean missile, he will ask someone else to deal with it. He lacks the ability to make an informed decision to resolve this in any manner. Since he seems to think that the Koreans, Iranians and Castros can be 'talked' to as human beings, who is foolish enough to think that he will respond in any way shape or form? I am shocked that the destroyer has not been called back to port in America (or as I prefer, the USSA - United Socialist States of America). If any of you out there think that he will do anything to free the American citizen being held, you need to watch reruns of his American arrogancy tour of Europe.