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"Every government interference in the economy consists of giving an unearned benefit, extorted by force, to some men at the expense of others."

Ayn Rand

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THE CONSTITUTION NEED NOT APPLY

By
Neal Boortz
@ March 18, 2009 8:19 AM
Permalink | Comments (31) | TrackBacks (0)

Does this ring a bell with anyone .. particularly anyone up there in Washington?

Article 1 Section 9

No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed.

Article 1 Section 10

No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.

Yeah ... it's in our Constitution ... not that the constitution matters that much anymore.

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What others are saying

  • laws/ constitution comment response
    So you're saying that constitutions preceded laws?
  • Constitutions
    Maybe constitutions were a good idea in 1787 when life was slower and people weren't as educated but in 2009 we need to be able to do things more quickly. In 1787, we didn't have the internet and the ability to disseminate information like we do now.

    Laws are all we need now. Constitutions are from a long gone era. They were great at the time.
  • smoke and mirrors!!!
    Like most good witch hunts, my guess is this is all about diversion. What is going on right now while the media is distracted?

    Chris
  • Ex Post Facto
    @ Bob Terwilliger:

    No, the income was earned in 2008. It was DISTRIBUTED in 2009. There is a BIG difference. Perhaps you should take a course in tax law before making such a comment?

    Besides, the "ex post facto" part of it is that the money is already earned from a 2008 contract, and they will be taxing it at a new rate from a law passed in 2009. That's unconstitutional, and the Feds will spend millioins defending their unconstitutional law in court, where they will eventually lose.

    If they didn't want these bonuses paid, Congress should have allowed AIG to go bankrupt and have the judge void the contracts.

    @ Boortz:

    Darn, it, I was going to blog this tonight after I got home from work. Now I look like a follower...
  • Bankruptcy serves a purpose
    "Capitalism without bankruptcy is like Christianity without HELL." - Frank Borman

    That is the best quote I have heard in a long time. Should have let AIG and the others go to bankruptcy. It would have exploded as its own news item, and it would have equally exposed the flaws in either the Fed, centralized banking, banking committees, or lack of SEC controls.
  • The States do violate Section 10...
    ...by transacting business in federal reserve notes (paying state employees, collecting state taxes, enforcing money judgments, etc). They do it every day because we let them. Why not get some real money (gold/silver) and see who in your business network will accept it? The whole reason governments fear leaving fiat money is because doing so would allow citizens to be financially responsible and force the government to do likewise.
  • Sorry Ben
    Just to real....you wouldn't believe how much of that cr*p I have heard like that for real....So LESS BEN... the rest stands.

    Sorry again Ben
  • Ex post facto
    There is nothing ex post facto about it. The income was received last week, in 2009. It is still 2009. Congress can change the 2009 tax code all it wants until December 31, 2009. Sure, they are pandering to the wealth envy crowd, but they unquestionably have the authority to do it.
  • What's good for the Goose....
    If accepting bailout money from the Federal Government somehow voids contractual agreements of private companies, GM and Chrysler should take advantage of this new opportunity and void the contracts with the unions.

    Let's see just how far the government wants to push this one.
  • D.D., ever heard of sarcasm?
    Geez, maybe I was too deadpan and not over the top enough (if that's possible), but you can't mock liberals thesedays without getting accused of BEING one...

    It's so funny, liberals were all for majority rule until California's Proposition 8 unexpectedly passed. Now they know the goal is to have "the right people" in office. Looks like they have that now.
  • Fighting back
    Why don't any of these companies actually fight back? Why are they taking it where the sun don't shine and letting these crooks in congress control them? Can't we sue congress for violating the Constitution? I don't know the answer maybe some of you can help answer that. *sigh...
  • Ahem
    I sense that maybe you were being sarcastic? I hope so. This country is not a democracy. Or should I say, it was not MEANT to be. This is what you describe and it seems that is surely the direction we seem to be headed in full steam towards oligarchy. Unless we stop it now.
  • The Federal Reserve is illegal
    make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts.

    If we are going to site the constitution lets look at that above line. It was illegal for the Congress to give the Federal Reserve the right to print fiat paper money. Not only that but the bill was never ratified by the number of states that were needed.
    Why no one in the main stream media or even the so called new media doesn't report on this is shame. Another reason why Ron Paul is the ONLY politician in Washington that is actually for upholding the constitution.
  • AHEM!!! Ben your scary
    What does it matter about some silly legalese in the Constitution AND
    Let no obstacle get in our way

    AND

    It's The Will Of The People, which is the very definition of law, isn't it?

    NO! All your talking about is MOB RULE! Pure and simple. People like you have two basic problems, you haven't learned that when you get angry, you quit thinking and second, your blamingthe wrong people. Why don't you take a look at the Tenth Amendment. Then start holding your beloved politicans feet to the fire and make them come up with some answers.

    To those of you who voted for the bunch now in charge, I say this:

    "IF THIS WERE A REPUBLICAN CONTROLLED CONGRESS PULLING THIS C*AP, THERE WOULD BE HOWLS AND OUTCRY FOR HEARINGS AND INVESTIGATIONS WITH SPECIAL PROSECUTORS. YET MANY TRY TO JUSTIFY WHAT OUR LAW MAKERS ARE DOING AND ARE FAR TOO WILLING TO LOOK THE WRONG DIRECTION. PEOPLE WHO PUT THESE CLOWNS IN OFFICE WOULD RATHER CHOKE THEN ADMIT THEIR MISTAKE. WHILE MANY SCREAM ABOUT THIS 163 MILLION AND DEMAND HEADS ON A PIKE, YOU NEVER SEE THE BILLIONS THAT ARE TRULY BEING MISSPENT. IF CONSERVITIVES NOT GOING TO PAY ATTENTION AND BE THIS EASILY MISDIRECTED AND LIBERALS ARE GOING TO CONTINUE NOT TO ADMIT THIS IS NOT THE CHANGE THEY HOPED FOR....THEN i SAY FINE. YOU GET WHAT YOU DESERVEW! ONLY PROLEM IS, YOUR DRAGGING THE REST OF US OVER THE CLIFF WITH YOU!

    The Obama Show - starring gongress -- the funnist reality show on tv.
  • Greed is the new Communism, it MUST be stopped AT ANY PRICE!
    I remember Nixon and the Viet Nam war when the big menace to the USA was the spread of Communism and lots of resources were spent on stopping it. Now our nemesis is the spread of greed.

    What does it matter about some silly legalese in the Constitution when Those #$*@ executives are getting MILLION DOLLAR BONUSES! WE CANNOT LET THIS HAPPEN!!1! Let no obstacle get in our way!

    It's The Will Of The People, which is the very definition of law, isn't it? Isn't it, Neal??? ... ahem.
  • Constitution = Social Contract
    Of course they don't care. The constitution is nothing more than a contract with the people. Since they are attacking contracts why would the constitution be any different?
  • That's a two-fer
    . . .impairing the Obligation of Contracts AND Ex-post-facto taxation.

    And, of course, nobody mentions Sen. Chris Dodd slipped in a provision SPECIFICIALLY ALLOWING AIG Bonuses.

    But we can't have little things like facts and the Law of the Land get in the way of our Propaganda.

    One ticket to Galt's Gulch, One-way, please. . .
  • There you again
    Citing the Constitution. Those Founding Fathers didn't even have reality TV and WWF? How could the know how to set up a system of governance that would function beautifully for 200 years?

    Some guys are rich! Time to burn our founding document!
  • Re: Marbury vs. Madison
    Correct you are Scott. It is not just the words of the Constitution that need to be remembered but the context from which the words were derived. There is no shortage of contextual elements to find the specifics of what the Constitution means. If the Congress and Supreme Court would simply start with the Federalist Papers, we could avoid the issue of the Constitution being dismissed as mere semantics. Remember the big case last year over the 2nd amendment? Scalia used writings from the 1780's to support the meaning of "bearing arms."
  • The Constitution Need Not Apply
    Article 1 Section 9 applies to the National Government. Since the AIG bonuses were paid under 2008 tax regulations, any law passed to impose new taxes would be Ex Post Facto and unconstitutional. Also, since the bailout has a provision allowing the payment of bonuses owed under contracts, a law rescinding that protection, aimed specifically at AIG, would also be Ex Post Facto, and possibly a Bill of Attainder.
  • ex post facto
    Apparently a few people here failed to understand that section 9 applied to the federal government and section 10 applied to the states.

    However, beyond that, our wonderful court system has probably provided sufficient wiggle room for the Congress to call this "regulatory" or "no punitive"

    This is more of the shift the blame game. When is America going to wake up and realize the problem is more in Washington than Wall St.?
  • CONTRACTS
    This scares the hell out of me. What a slippery slope we are on. The government was formed to uphold contractual obligations and to provide for the common defense of the people. Once the government buys into these companies they create a grandiose sense of entitlement to micro-manage according to the populism. Even communist China allows its businesses to practice with more flexibility regarding internal contractual agreements.

    So now we are seeing the beginning of the end of contractual obligations at the behest of government destroying our ability to defend ourselves against such overt oppression via the guns of government.
  • Ex Post Facto laws
    I hate to tell anyone this, but our lovely supreme court ruled that ex post facto laws are just fine if they involve retroactive taxes. Remember clinton's tax hike back in 1993, retroactive to 1992? The supreme court ruled it constitutional.

    Let's face it, after that ruling and Kelo vs. New London the Constitution is null and void if it interferes with D.C. getting your money.
  • Thanks, Neal for reminding us...
    ....that Democrats in Washington tend to ignore--or worse--blatantly defy the Constitution on a daily basis....

    Printing money, impairing contracts, entering into treaties, etc. is just "business as usual" to democrats like Schmucky Schumer, Maxine "don't Axe me no questions" Waters, Charles "Slumdog" Rangel, "SanFranGranNan" Pelosi, Harry "The War Is Lost" Reid, etc.

    Yeah, now that's change we can believe in.
  • "no state"
    Well, the USA is a state in the sense that France and Italy are states, but I don't think that's what it means in this context.
  • But...
    No *state* can pass an ex post facto law. Does this prevent the federal government from doing it though?
  • The Constitiution.. What's that??
    Since the early 20th century, the US Government has been operating way outside of the US Constitution, i.e. Social Security, the New Deal, the War on Poverty, the War on Drugs need I say more?

    With that said, what is there to stop the US Federal Government to start operating within their Constitutional limits? After all this American Idol loving, Daily Show watching, government school educated American populous doesn't care anymore.
  • Marbury v. Madison 5 U.S. 137 (1803)
    "Thus, the particular phraseology of the constitution of the United States confirms and strengthens the principle, supposed to be essential to all written constitutions, that a law repugnant to the constitution is void, and that courts, as well as other departments, are bound by that instrument."
    - Chief Justice Marshall

    It's time for the people to remember the value of the Constitution
  • Thank you Boortz!
    And just what is a Bill of Attainder? For all you folks who don't know how to use a dictionary, it is a law that declares that someone is guilty of a crime and proscribes punishment. That is exactly, what any penalty tax on the men and women earning these bonuses would be. It would be unconstitutional and by rights should end up in court.

    The other part of this problem is that this is just another step down the slippery slope of socio-fascism. It's government control of the minutest details (compensation) of a "privately" owned enterprise. Soon, we'll all be referring to Obama as Herr Obama. Somebody save us....can we clone George Washington?
  • THE CONSTITUTION NEED NOT APPLY
    FWIW, Mark Levin said on his show last night that Ex Post facto only applied to criminal law, not this bailout.
  • No State
    Is it just me or does Section 10 start out with "Not STATE shall..."? Or does the term "State" in this case not refer to a State but instead the Federal Gov't?
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